The greatest programs: No. 25, N.C. State

Joe, Raleigh, NC — Wed, 23 Apr 2008 05:48:27 GMT

" Only Adolph Rupp’s Kentucky squads won more games in the 1950s,..."

NC State won the most games during the 1950s. Kentucky had the best winning percentage during the decade, but finished fourth in wins because NCAA sanctions canceled their 1953 season.

The greatest programs: No. 25, N.C. State

RANearly — Wed, 23 Apr 2008 18:52:41 GMT

Referring to the comment above, Valvano was never accused of point shaving...the link itself is evidence of my point. This is a VERY misleading phrase and tarnishes a great coach. The NCAA found that Valvano was guilty of nothing. Some players sold shoes outside his knowledge, but frankly, much worse stuff is uncovered today with NO NCAA actions.

The greatest programs: No. 25, N.C. State

James C., Willow Springs, NC — Wed, 23 Apr 2008 19:10:41 GMT

"How did a team without any stars, which had lost to Chattanooga in the first round the year before and would miss the tourney the year after, pull off that kind of run?"

People never seem to give the '83 State team the credit it deserves. It won 10 games--10--against teams that were #1 in the polls at one point in the year. While there were no "stars," the collection of Whittenburg, Lowe and Bailey were a very strong trio of experienced players capable of beating anyone on any night. They would've won more games had Whittenburg not missed a good portion of the year with a broken foot.

Ironically, had he not broken his foot then State probably would've never won the title. They became a better team without him, and a dominant one when he returned.

I think you're shortchanging that Pack at #25. Everette Case was responsible for the birth of the ACC and cutting down the nets. Reynolds Coliseum was the first college basketball palace of the South. David Thompson is arguably the greatest college basketball player of all time. Two national titles and 10 ACC Championships...six more than the next closest team in the league. I'd say the Pack belongs in the top 20, possibly in the top 15.

I'll be eager, let's say, to see which 5-10 programs you consider to be better than N.C. State.

The greatest programs: No. 25, N.C. State

GoDawgs,Athens, GA — Wed, 23 Apr 2008 19:37:21 GMT

NC State is one of 7 schools with National Championships by more than 1 coach. Should be higher than 25th in my opinion.

The greatest programs: No. 25, N.C. State

BW, Winston-Salem, NC — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 00:41:07 GMT

How does being in a conference with Duke and UNC hurt our ranking? The only thing that should hurt us is the fact that we haven't done ANYTHING since the late 80's, but I don't think that drops a top 10 all time program all the way to 25. At that point, we were behind only UNC in ACC championships and tied with them in National Championships. I'm with JamesC... I'm interested to see who is ahead of us.

The greatest programs: No. 25, N.C. State

JB — Thu, 24 Apr 2008 12:37:16 GMT

This entry goes in a lot of the right directions but misses on various key specifics.

One example is the misunderstanding of the 1983 team that was clearly a Top 10-15 team before Dereck Whittenburg broke his foot in the first half of game vs #1 Virginia when State had a 19 point lead. Additionally, people don't realize that State played ELEVEN games against teams who had held a Top 5 ranking (and even more in the Top 20) that season - Memphis, Louisville, Houston, UNLV, UNC x3 and UVA x4 Think about that brutal of a schedule!

The following link provides a lot of commentary on that 1983 issue and also provides a lot of other interesting links.

http://www.statefansnation.com/index.php/archives/2005/04/04/happy-anniversary/

A few bullet points to enhance the 'tradition' section that mentions cutting down the nets:

* NC State also is responsible for the advent of the alley-oop in college basketball as an alternative to get David Thompson the ball near the rim during the era of no dunking.

* NC State has also been one of the driving forces behind a few of the NCAA Tournament's expansions.

First in the mid 1970s, the Wolfpack's win over highly ranked Marylan in 1974 and the highly-rated Wolfpack's upset at the hands of UNC-CH in 1975 (when Thompson had cramps/injury) sparked the NCAA to expand.

Then, in the early to mid-1980s, NC State's Athletics Director, Willis Casey, led the charge from expansion from 48 teams to 64 teams - effectively creating what March Madness is today.

Again, there's more. But, I just wanted to get that out there.

The greatest programs: No. 25, N.C. State

Mike Miller — Fri, 25 Apr 2008 03:03:39 GMT

When I started putting this list together, I figured State would be higher than 25th, probably more in the 15-20 range given its rich history. But the Pack's recent struggles hurt them too much in these rankings. As to the comment with UNC and Duke hurting them, I meant it cuts down on a team's chances at success to have two programs like that in the same conference: fewer opportunities for league titles, wins, etc. Should there be more weight given to playing in the ACC? Perhaps. But then one has parse every program depending on the perception of that league. Put it this way: If State starts winning games at that same clip it did in the 70s, it'll soar back up the list.

The greatest programs: No. 25, N.C. State

Bill — Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:54:25 GMT

Miller's analysis is spot on. I still disagree with NC State being put behind schools like Notre Dame, Texas, Temple and Oklahoma. Bottom line is those schools have never won national titles nor ever had the kind of teams NC State had when it was at its best.